What is music to you?

[Lanthus]

anytime I'm asked this I have to give a two parter.
bear with my wall-o-text, here
Music is organized sound,
but what is my music/music to me?

the people that ask me this always expect some sort of flowery glurge about music being like love, or flowers, or doves, or some other things a 13 year old thinks is cute.
Music is not like that at all to me
music is like some sort of puzzle I can't solve, or like an itch I can't scratch.
It's like a bad game that I can't master, yet I keep coming back even though I'll never win.
It's like an exgirlfriend I need to get over but no matter how hard you try, there you are again calling her, and then you're like wait a minute you called me first!
and she's like don't change the subject!
and you're like No we need to talk about this! and she's like....
what was I saying?
Music is there in my head all the time sitting there mocking me and I try and I try to get what's in my head down to paper but just like everything else I try to make it's fails, and fails hard.
Music has never been easy for me, really nothing has ever came easy for me

TL;DR

Music is like a nagging girlfriend to me.

[Warbalist]

@Warabalist

I expect more out of music than you do. I consider that music compete crap,yes. I could give a shit if people get drunk to it or have a good time. I like music that has real meaning and takes real talent to produce. Also, I expect the artists to write their own music, not pay others to do it for them.

I'm thinking we might think similarly, but because of the wonder of the internet, it's not coming through so clearly. I'm not sure if you expect more from the music as much as expect more from the composers and performers of the music. What you're talking about doesn't have much to do with the actual notes on a page which convey only the idea of music.

Let me put it another way: if a Katy Perry song had the same chord progression as an Iron Maiden song, would that make the Iron Maiden song emotionless? Of course not! What about the performance? Well, that's probably where I'd start agreeing with you. Music can be emotionless when it either means nothing to the performer or the listener and on top of that, it's completely subjective.

And as far as expecting artists to write their own music, are you willing to throw out every classical performance, orchestral-based music in its entirety, Motown and nearly all popular music before the Beatles?

"I consider that music is, by its very nature, essentially powerless to express anything at all, whether a feeling, an attitude of mind, or psychological mood, a phenomenon of nature, etc….Expression has never been an inherent property of music. That is by no means the purpose of its existence."

-Igor Stravinsky (from his autobiography)

Oh, snap! I agree with Stravinsky! You write what you write, but it's the listener who will interpret it, so screw what you thought you were writing about! This is why psychoacoustics is such an awesome field of study.

[Warbalist]

Sometimes how music is made IS the concept attempted to be communicated. It might not be as listenable or enjoyable to most but pushing what is music and what it can be is important. Most of the time it may be feeling or a message but other times its as much about the creation.

This reminds me very much of George Crumb's work. Nice one, Freewave!

[Anforium]

@Warabalist

I expect more out of music than you do. I consider that music compete crap,yes. I could give a shit if people get drunk to it or have a good time. I like music that has real meaning and takes real talent to produce. Also, I expect the artists to write their own music, not pay others to do it for them.

I'm thinking we might think similarly, but because of the wonder of the internet, it's not coming through so clearly. I'm not sure if you expect more from the music as much as expect more from the composers and performers of the music. What you're talking about doesn't have much to do with the actual notes on a page which convey only the idea of music.

Let me put it another way: if a Katy Perry song had the same chord progression as an Iron Maiden song, would that make the Iron Maiden song emotionless? Of course not! What about the performance? Well, that's probably where I'd start agreeing with you. Music can be emotionless when it either means nothing to the performer or the listener and on top of that, it's completely subjective.

And as far as expecting artists to write their own music, are you willing to throw out every classical performance, orchestral-based music in its entirety, Motown and nearly all popular music before the Beatles?

To address the emotionless/emotional thing, it is definetely more of a performance thing, but the composition affects it as well. I mean, if Rush (My favorite band) performed "California Gurls", I would still hate it. It's hard to explain, but to give musical examples, listen to this:

Rush- Nobody's Hero


and then this:

Ke$ha - Blah Blah Blah


Obvious emotional difference.

And to address the writing your own music, there is a huge difference between playing someone else's previously written music and paying someone else to do it because you are too lazy. Take One Direction for example, they could easily go online or buy a book and learn theory to write their own songs. But instead, if you look on Wikipedia, they co-wrote three songs of their album. The rest they were not even involved in. All it is is laziness. I have absolutely nothing against playing covers, or in the case of classical, playing someone else's composed music. I was more referring to pop/rock artists who pay to have people write their songs.

[Aftermath]

I think that the definition of music is a personal threshold that we all set, therefore if you don't think that something is music, it's not (to you).

It's similar to the fact that we cannot determine with absolute ubiquity that something is "enjoyable". A person's opinion on whether or not something is enjoyable is not a fundamental property of the object, but rather something only gained through interpretation. Let's consider a theoretical object that every conscious being that exists, will ever exist, and has every existed considers enjoyable. This does not make the object enjoyable by definition, as even though no being will ever think otherwise, the opposite opinion still exists in theory.

My definition of music is fairly broad - I consider music to be sound that conveys an emotion. I don't think that music has to have melodies, harmonies, or regular intervals, but rather the only thing that separates "sound" from "music" for me is the fact that it has been interpreted, and that an emotion has been conveyed. Therefore a sound that has never been heard by a sentient being cannot be considered music, as emotion is incapable of being conveyed without a creature capable of interpreting it.

For example, take a listen to the sounds in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQnv-BYb8MM
I doubt anybody before me has ever called this music. It lacks the basic elements of what the average human being calls music - Structure, progression, and melodic tones. Because of the (assumed) fact the nobody before me considered this music, it wasn't. But when I, as a living, thinking creature, analyzed the sounds of the birds and formed a conclusion, it changed. Because of the fact a conscious entity tried to interpret the emotions of the ambiance of crows, the moment I called it music, the moment I detected emotion, this video will forever be music. In fact, this video was always music, for as long as it is, has been, or will be interpreted as such throughout the entirety of it's existence.

That brings up an interesting discussion as well - How can something that was not considered music suddenly become music, not only from the moment that it was called such and onwards, but also in the past? How can we overwrite the definition of events that already happened? I'll answer that with the same question from a different perspective: Is music that hasn't been created yet still music right now? We can think of time as another axis of reality, the same as length, width and depth, so we could even rephrase the question to something like "Does an object that is so far away that I can't detect it exist?" At this moment in time, you cannot know whether any sound that you don't perceive as music IS music.

Every sound you will ever hear is either music, or is in a quantum state of being music and not music at the same time. Only when the universe comes to an end, and it can be assured that no more events will ever happen, can something be solidified as "not music", assuming it survived the entire existence of the universe without being classified as such. The only problem is that the totality of existence cannot ever be viewed as a whole, because any observer that remains existing to make such an inference is a part of this totality. Therefore, nothing can ever be proven to be "not music".

I define music absolutely within the first two paragraphs, and personally in the rest of them, but I'd love to hear your thoughts on my rambling!

Enough chit-chat, I've got vocal splicing to do.

[Warbalist]

[Lots of words]

That is a really broad definition. I like it. I also like the sound of the crows. I may have to sample it and turn it into a scary synth.

A quantum state of music and not music? This is the kind of overthinking that stretches your mind.

I like you, Aftermath. Have fun slicing up them thar samples.

[Freewave]

I'm going to drop off some examples of some of the far out genres of music. Stuff that 99% of people would run screaming from or beat with sticks. Just in that some stuff really does push the boundaries of what "is" music but each certainly has their own fans. A music genre wouldn't exist if NOBODY made that type of music or listened to it.

Some Harsh Noise

"Okay so I have to say this is probably my favorite Merzbow album, besides Houjoue. I could attribute it to my earlier days of music listening when I was really into metal, since this album is supposedly Merzbow's take on metal and grindcore, which is pretty awesome mostly because it sounds nothing like metal and almost nothing like grindcore, a genre which I now have an affinity for. It's pretty much the most extreme and harsh Merzbow ever, and is almost frightening in some points—as I write this, I'm halfway through "Slave New Desart", and the gibberish cartoon-character clip set amidst the noise is damn freaky. "~5thEye

"It is an exhausting and terrifying experience listening to this album in its entirety. Venereology is massive, inexhaustible, and overwhelming in its force. It is not simply that it is harsh and brutal on the ears, it's that it is so unrelentingly which makes this album difficult to get through. Essentially, it is a sustained, album-long crescendo composed of harsh electronic noise many layers deep. Here and there some aspect of the noise will stand out over the others or the entire seething cauldron will shift its emphasis, but for the most part it seems like endless aural brutality. But, I find that there is always a point at which I become accustomed to the chaos and high volume, and I start to notice the subtlety and nuance (yeah, you heard me) underneath the clamor. Hidden there is always an amazing interplay between sounds and sonic textures, which I find very pleasant. It takes a while to become desensitized in this way, but it is far more satisfying to actually explore the depth in Merzbow rather than merely taking in how loud and chaotic it is."~pthora




A little EAI

"Sachiko M, Toshimaru Nakamura & Otomo Yoshihide have recreated in breathtaking miniature, with the most meager implements imaginable, everything. Using call and response, soothing high frequency drone layers, white light inspiration and wisdom fallout, this invokes states of miles deep oceanic jellyfish chemical discourse or the interior processes of your brain. Consequently, this is the purest, easiest listening that you will ever experience."~novahead

"In my never ending pursuit for challenging music, I recently downloaded Good Morning Good Night by Sachiko M, Toshimaru Nakamura & Otomo Yoshihide. It is nothing like I expected it to be, in fact it is unlike anything else I have ever heard and has proved to be the most confusing album I've encountered. "Is this music?" is one of the things I thought about while listening. Certinally it is a unique album but I struggle when trying to think of what it's purpose is, as clearly it is not intended to be listened to like every other album. To me, it's more like a piece of sound art: a ghostly presence that fills the room, not really being intrusive but making itself shown and creating a general atmosphere."~hey_light




Some Musique concrète

"Now the main question is, should i be ever given the permission to rate any music by Stockhauseen? After 5 straight listens to this album I am still stuck on the same question why and how this resembles any modern classical music. If I ever do rate him the chances are that in 2/3 years tim I would feel rather embarrassed of my own self in rating/judging him. From what little I have seen of this man un various videos, his music is also a medium of his own research on the science of sound and the perception that people have towards them, it simply goes beyond the gentle and sweet sounding EITS, that the critics tend to favour, or even the rageful and rebellious Pearl Jam, which the radio sells and makes you believe is quality music.

But despite that one should listen to such music, with this at least one will question the very basic question of nature of music, its norms and boundaries or what has been told to us about music that we know now. And remember this was all back in 1956" ~Has9




Some earliest Free Improvisation

"AMMMusic stands the test of time both as a remarkably prescient session and as an utterly powerful and deep piece of 20th century music. Drummer Eddie Prevost's superb and detailed liner notes document AMM's early history, including the confusion engendered not only in audiences and critics but even in the band members themselves, unsure if they were in a free jazz ensemble, a contemporary classical group, neither, or both. The aphorisms adorning the original LP issue (the disc includes additional portions of the concert) give some indication of what was facing listeners and musicians at the time: "An AMM performance has no beginning or ending. Sounds outside the performance are distinguished from it only by individual sensibility." Or: "Every noise has a note."

Even so, at this early stage in its development, there are more "normal" instrumental sounds with a conceptual basis in either jazz or classical music than there would be later on. Lou Gare's tenor saxophone wrings out occasional avant-garde peals that wouldn't have sounded too out of place in Sun Ra's band of the period, and Prevost's drumming shares some affinities with the energy players of the day. Similarly, Cornelius Cardew's piano and Lawrence Sheaff's cello sometimes refer to this or that modern classical tradition. But the overall sound of the group, even in 1966, was so different, so idiosyncratic, that it's not at all surprising that both new jazz and contemporary classical audiences were baffled, if not horrified. The experimentation in sonic assault, noise, and chance sound (including transistor radios) would, however, reach the rock fringes (as Prevost points out) in the work of '60s bands like Pink Floyd as well as later industrial groups like Test Dept. and even the JAMC."~AMG



And then there's something called Brony music that's music about pink ponies or something. I'd include some samples but I'm too scared to go on youtube and find some. Don't want to post "music" that gets too weird.

[XXDarkShadow79XX]

It took me a while to come up with this, but I suddenly realize that

Music is just sound we give meaning to and become emotionally attached to. In fact, the concept of "cacophonic" is really just an artificial concept (Much like math and time) we learn and develop through listening to the standards of music, which is why creating new genres and types of music is so hard. Picture this: someone who has never listened to music is listening to their first song. It is very off key, the beats go nowhere and the tempo rises and falls hundreds of times by the time the song ends. In other words, to us, the song really sucks. But would he be able to tell? No, he wouldn't.

Our culture has made it so that when we are born we are filled with the (incredibly basic) musical rules that define music. We make music, the next generation hears it, and follows in our footsteps, and because of the sheer quantity of music around us, our "definition" of music (or bad music) is very quickly formed.

Soooo... yeah.

[Pony 1million]

Music is the silence between the notes.

[Nine Volt]

Music is something that I truly enjoy doing. I hope to never stop making it, partly because I enjoy it and partly because the thought that there are people out there who actually like it is just amazing. I don't hope to become famous or rich off of it, I just want to make people (and myself) happy. Music lets me communicate with others in a way that no other media can represent, and plus, people will actually listen to music. Think of it this way: Someone is frustrated at the world and posts a rant blog about it. Nobody cares, everyone ignores. But translate that into some gritty, twisted dubstep, and suddenly people listen and notice and maybe even care or like it.

Well, that's all I have. It's 11 PM here

[Warbalist]

Freewave: Thanks for bringing up musique concrete! That era of music really pushed the limits, and I love it for that. I must mention my favorite of the composers who worked on things such as this: Iannix Xenakis and his amazing work on this one:

Nine Volt: Those are quite nearly my thoughts. Now try translating/estimating someone else's emotions! Composing from a different perspective like that is weird. To try to compose with someone else's thoughts and ideals is strange, indeed.

[ph00tbag]

Good Post

This gets toward my view on what music is. It's almost as though music is the kind of thing where if you try to define it, you often wind up excluding something that probably should be counted as music. It's better not to worry about the definition, and to simply listen, because if you don't listen, then you won't hear.

[vladnuke]

Music is the not-neccarily-verbal aspect of art.

However, art does not denote merit.

[K3WRO]

Music is my life

Without music, I won't have any of this life, I would have to stop having breakfast or starve,

Anyway, I see music as an auditory form of art, it's media, it's diverse, with many styles fitting to the certain type of people.
Music is one of the most astounding invention in human history, It might even be one of those things that makes us, humans unique.

[Warbalist]

Music is my life

Without music, I won't have any of this life, I would have to stop having breakfast or starve,

Anyway, I see music as an auditory form of art, it's media, it's diverse, with many styles fitting to the certain type of people.
Music is one of the most astounding invention in human history, It might even be one of those things that makes us, humans unique.

Dude, it's all about Cinnamon Life!

[Stars In Autumn]

Music is... many things to me. Different genres can do different things. Classical can fill be with wonder, excitement, contentment, or many other emotions. Soundtracks can fill me with nostalgia for games enjoyed in my youth, excitement, sorrow, or pretty much anything depending on whatever scene the track was written for.

EDM is a little different. It's less complex in musical structure but focuses so much more on sound. A well designed synth with just the right reverb can send you into a state of bliss while an intense kick/snare with a stabby chord synth can cause you to move without thinking. It appeals much more to the part of the brain that doesn't require analysis. House and trance can get me to dance even when there's others around. I won't even care if I dance well, I just enjoy feeling the music. Which is pretty much the only time I never care what others think of me.

Music is so ingrained in my life that silence is louder than music. I listen to it when I work, produce, drive, play games, and sleep. I'd much rather be blind than deaf.

[NegaNote]

Music is emotional. No matter what style it is in, no matter what genre, music brings emotions into the listener. It can bring on an urge to dance, it can lift your spirits, it can get you just plain thinking, it can evoke real feelings of deep sadness or regret or aching, but it will affect you. It allows you to convey these emotions in a way that no painting, no story could ever do. Personally, I find that while lyrics are wonderful, sometimes it's the instrumentals that really do the trick. When you write, play, or perform music, you bring these emotions to the fore. A musician can spend hours and hours trying to perfect something that no-one will even notice, simply because it brings on these emotions at a sub-conscious level.

[TheLonging]

Freewave summed it up in his two posts, so I'd like to expand.

Music, to me, is art. And if it's art that can express emotions, or an image that's coherent, it's music. The following is all subjective, and whether you find it good or bad isn't that relevant.

Merzbow is music. His noise is designed in such a way that the means to making his music is as much of an art as the music, which ranges from hatred and anger to bliss and serenity (somewhat). It's art, and wonderfully crafted. It's as much music as anything else.

Ke$ha, Katy Perry, and Lady Gaga are music. The writes to inspire fun times (for some anyway) and enjoyment. Some of their songs are even emotional and can resonate (the Born This Way album was inspiring and hit deep for me, despite how most of the album was average, and while their music (and other derivative knockoffs) are the norm, they have an energy that's far from normal, or at least, compared with their pop equivalents 10 years ago.

Junichi Masuda is music. For those who don't recognize the name, think back to the Pokemon games. You remember it, don't you? For us now, it inspires nostalgia and the fondness of our childhoods, while for someone playing it then (and even now), the chiptune music is upbeat and happy, and even Lavender Town helps inspire fear and uneasiness in us.

Three wildly different genres, all of which music.

[Flinckie]

First, we need to understand what sound is. The answer is pressure waves. Our brains interpret these waves into what we call sound. And that's pretty much it for the definition of sound. Then there's the definition of music, which can be defined as organized sound.

This raises questions (or at least it did for me.) Why is music so appealing so to us? What makes it different from any random conglomeration of sounds?

My guess is that the answer lies in the human voice. Vocal communication carries a rhythm. An unknown number of years ago, some tribe somewhere developed a language (grunting and pointing included.) The path was pretty straightforward from there. When a language exists, someone will eventually mimic a bird or something, and therefore inventing singing.

So bottom line is; music is a by-product of our ability to vocally communicate. If I were in a really existential mood, I would probably say that music is an illusion, just like life itself.

I don't know how I became a musician :/

[Dr_Dissonance]

So bottom line is; music is a by-product of our ability to vocally communicate.

I'm just going to throw some fun facts into the fray.

Language actually developed from music, not the other way around! My choir director edited a big book about it that was released a few months ago. I've only read a snippet of it, but he talks a lot about it when we're doing choir conducting.

So, that raises the question, what was music to them? The primitive folk?

[Warbalist]

So bottom line is; music is a by-product of our ability to vocally communicate.

I'm just going to throw some fun facts into the fray.

Language actually developed from music, not the other way around! My choir director edited a big book about it that was released a few months ago. I've only read a snippet of it, but he talks a lot about it when we're doing choir conducting.

So, that raises the question, what was music to them? The primitive folk?

Well now, that's fascinating. Could you imagine an entire society not having a verbal form of communication?

[Mr. Bigglesworth]

to me, music is a way of expressing your own little imaginary world to whoever is willing to listen. I like to take my listeners into a small story whenever I write a song. Ambient or anything else I write is all directed to telling a story.

When I listen to music, what I want to do is be able to envision the world that the artist is trying to paint in his or her own eyes. so that I can see what they're trying to show me.

Music to me is imagination. A world that is of your own mind, but at the same time you're trying to share it with the rest of world through the delivery of descriptive sound and emotional composing. My music in particular is a string of little stories that mean a lot to me and my character as a person. Sad emotional songs, but also with a condemning calmness to them.

Songs like If Equestria Burns (which is about the betrayal of the people destroying equestria)
or songs like Going It Alone (where Rainbowdash remains the last survivor of her friends) where the emotion is delivered by a solo instrument, as she flies away in what she knows are her last moments.

Or even songs like In the Realm of the Liars, where the fear and desperation of the changeling kind grows drastically as their own kind face extinction and for their last hope they flee their dying home to find a potential way of survival.

All of these things are meant to be delivered. Emotions like sorrow, hope, desperation, anxiety, discovery, awe, fear, anguish, and the crushing fate of humility. They aren't meant to be happy emotions, but they're real ones that I feel are meant to be projected. Songs of mine will come about happiness and prosperity, but until these emotions are part of my world, I can't fairly display them to my listeners.

After all, those who listen to my music are listening to a little piece of myself, and i'm more than glad to share my world with them.

Exactly. I think music is a gateway into how someone sees the world, that can be applied to pretty much any musician. Skrillex included, his music entails that he just likes to have purely stupid fun, or at least it does in my eyes. The feeling people go for is usually interpretted by others subjective. But when you're actually told what it all means, it seems much more special because you know the motive.

My music doesn't really tell many stories (my latest thing is sort of about Dalek Invasions but that's just because of my sample contexts). But my sort of motive is just that I just like to create. I've always been a creative person, I just never had much of an outlet until recently.

[Elmorya]

To me music is everything kyoga said...in addition to that I like the concept of creation and such so I use music as an output of the physical ideas I come up with in my head. In short I try to make objects into sounds and such.

[nOk]

Music to me is quite simply any form of "sculpted" sound, made with creativity.

Music needs no melody
Music needs no rhythm
Music needs no harmony

If sound is made purposely and with the use of imagination, I believe it can classify as music
Sorry I don't have a deeper philosophy on the subject, but when it gets down to it, that really is what it is to me

[SpyPie]

Music is simply something that is interesting to the ears, it doesn't really even need to have a beat or a countable BPM, given the immense amount of possibilities that music is able to be played around with.
Harsh Noise is yes, still music, while (even in it's name it implies) that it is indeed just annoying noise, it's still music, because it's still listenable to human ears as music.